overrestored
15 years ago
I know I have gone on about this before... but it is very interesting to me.

Der Edel Kafer reiterates Rometsch's numbers of approx 500 Beeskows made. I don't think this is possible. Ex factory workers seem to confirm that Rometsch built them at about 1 every two weeks.

52 weeks a year equals 25 or 26 cars a year. If they started in 1950... and built them through 1957... 7 years... then 7 x 25 is 175 cars.

When I look at the body numbers and the year of that body... it confirms a slightly LESS than 25 per year accounting except for 1957 when maybe 40 cars were made. My car is body 230... and was built on a beetle manufactured in late 1956. They stopped production of the Beeskow in 1957 and the highest body numbers seen are in the 270's

Nobody has seen a car with a body number less than 3 digits.... which means that they started with car 100. The Split window cars don't have numbers but we have not seen any low 100's body numbers on the later curved windshield cars so I assume that 100 was the beginning of Split production (if over 100 split cabs were made... we would have seen more of them over the past 50 years)

I just can't see how they keep saying that 500 beeskows were built. I think that it is only 170- 175 cars built. The later Lawrence cars all seem to have 500 series body numbers in my limited experience. I don't know of any with other than a 500 series number but I presume there must be some in the 600? I presume again... that Rometsch started the Lawrence series with body number 500... being the first one.

Christian... can you show us the data and clear this up finally? Anyone else care to add their thoughts?

Eric
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overrestored
15 years ago
I would like to correct my own post. In that I can't read German... I think I made a mistake. The book states that there were 500 Rometsch Cars made.

Here is my wild guess:

175 Beeskows
+/-100 early Lawrence cars
+/- 20 later Lawrence cars
? Taxis
? Fiats, Borgwards, trucks, etc.
_______
500 total Rometsch vehicle production

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SplitPersonality
15 years ago
I fully support your theories Eric...ref our emailings a while back. Did you get the email I sent you last night?
overrestored
15 years ago
Yes I did get your email... did you get my response? Interesting about Bob's old car's history. I remember seeing that car for sale in Volksworld many years ago I think... Not sure of the chain of ownership... but it was cheap back then.

I never really thought about how many split window cars were made. I agree... I doubt that 75 of them were made... Hmmm.

This means that there may have been only around 100 to 125 Beeskows made... perhaps less. that would mean a survival rate of approx. 33 percent! Not too bad actually.

Christian... Trauggott... Any facts to share?


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SplitPersonality
15 years ago
Eric - no response from you in my mailbox...

There are numbers on the split windows, they are just much harder to find...the amount of cars in the Berlin workshop at the same time was probably much lower than in the mid-fifties, when series of cars where in progress at the same time.

Grundmann's latest split resto, the light blue one, is number 15X. It fully supports the theory on start at 100. The last (and only) known split number is 15X. The first curved window car with known number is Japan's #172. So 50-to-70 split window cars made in 3 years....is not unreasonable really.

There are several known Beeskows with numbers right after each other...for example 222,225,226,228... which is at least an indication that the 2XX-series was reserved for the VWs, but not really proof of anything I guess..

Interesting topic!
oldbug.com
15 years ago
One of the VW Magazines is doing a feature on my Lawrence car and is asking for production history numbers etc...and it is all such a mystery. I dont want to continue to feed rumours in yet another magazine...

Is Eric's theory correct?

Are there any Lawrence cars with numbers under 500?

How about over 600?

Do you think that perhaps my 59 model number 566 is the 66th Lawrence car? The black coupe that Mr Komori owns is supposedly #559...yet it has smooth sides which is a 1960 model attribute... :shock:

HEELLLLPP!
overrestored
15 years ago
it is possible that Mr. Komori's car... a new flat sided lawrence... was being built alongside orders for previous early Lawrence cars like yours. So depending on which car was started first... the numbers could be out of sequence.

I have read that when they changed over to the Lawrence style... they still had many Beeskow orders to fill. So Both Beeskows and Lawrences were being made at the same time in 1957.
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fantakid
15 years ago
Hi,
i checked today our 1961 Rometsch Lawrence Modell and it is body number 585.
As we heard from old workers it was the last Rometsch build ( the wall was build )
We also think that they started about 100 and that they did not stamp the old Beeskows
Bye Christian
jof
15 years ago
Günther Kaulmann stated the following:

"Der Fortschritt, der durch mein Akkordsystem erzielt wurde, wird am deutlichsten, wenn man das alte und das neue Arbeitssystem gegenüberstellt. Als ich bei Rometsch anfing, bauten 34 Mann pro Monat 4 Autos. Nachdem ich mein Akkordsystem eingeführt hatte, bauten 11 Mann 5 Autos pro Monat. Je nach Mitarbeiter stieg die Arbeitsproduktivität um 800 % bis 1000 %. Das war der entscheidende Unterschied."

Translates to "when I started working at Rometsch, 34 workers built 4 cars each months, later (when the Akkordsystem started 11 workers built 5 cars each month".

"Von Anfang 1956 bis Mitte 1959 wurden insgesamt nur 49 Fahrzeuge beiden Typs gebaut, wobei das Modell Beeskow überwiegte."

Translates to "From the beginning of 1956 until mid 1959 there have only been built a total of 49 Beeskow and Lawrence together, and it was more Beeskow than Lawrence models".

Source here:
https://www.historische-vws.de/goodies/rometsch.htm 

Regards Jörg
fantakid
15 years ago
Look,
if they started counting by 100 - then 4 cars per month, 12 months a year and they build about 10 years cars - that makes 100+480 = 580 cars
Our last build car has body number 585 - so i think were are all getting close to the real number of build Rometsches.
Bye Christian
SplitPersonality
15 years ago
"fantakid" wrote:

Hi,
i checked today our 1961 Rometsch Lawrence Modell and it is body number 585.
As we heard from old workers it was the last Rometsch build ( the wall was build )
We also think that they started about 100 and that they did not stamp the old Beeskows
Bye Christian



Hi Christian,
About a year ago I am quite sure you found and reported number 151 for your ex-Swiss/now blue Beeskow Split Convertible. I even saw pictures of the number stamp - yet you now claim they did not stamp the splits? What do you mean?

Oystein
SplitPersonality
15 years ago
Some thoughts on the subject....

A: Beeskow Split Windows: Series started on 100, latest (and only) known number is 151

B: Beeskow curved windows: Lowest known is #172, highest is #260. All #250 and up are on late '57 chassis, very close to the Lawrence model production. My guess is that they never reached the point of stamping any #3XX-numbers into a Beeskow model before the start of Lawrence.

The production pace has been reported from 2/month to 4/month - but the pace surely must have changed quite much over the years as tools and speed got updated. It was hardly constant and is hence a difficult point to judge. The build numbers speak for themselves.

SO - Theory #1: Total Beeskow production (split & curved windshield) - just under 200 total. Split production: Approx 60-70, Curved production: Approx 130-140.

Lawrence: Old Friedrich started a new model, new designer - with first car being #500. Last one quite firmly is #585.

SO - Theory #2: Totalt Lawrence production (curved side & smooth side) - 85 total.

My two cents...
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