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phil leadley Offline
#41 Posted : 16 July 2009 10:55:49(UTC)
phil leadley

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Great story Eric! Only a few among us has done their homework, you can never learn too much about a people and their "struggles". Ignorance is our most expensive commonity. (spell check is our most valuable). Here in the USA most people have no idea what the Europeans went through and the emotional
burdens they carry as a result of the war. Shame on us and our arrogance, perhaps we can open our own people eyes to history. I've even known educated
young Europeans who didn't know what the Maginot Line, or the Marshall Plan was!, OMG it was in their own backyard!. I won't waste my time with our young people, nuh said. I learned a long time ago to appreciate not only the hardware, but also the history, food, their way of life, their culture. You come away with a better understanding, or a flavor so to say, I gone out of my way to return the favor when I can, no regrets, just fond memories.

I hope, I have not sounded like an idiot standing on a soapbox in the town square. But, i won't apologize for my passion or love of beautiful machines, and the work it took to create them.

My girlfriend understands.








Ol' Shakey Jake, miss ya!
overrestored Offline
#42 Posted : 08 November 2010 07:04:37(UTC)
overrestored


Rank: pre67vw Junkie

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Posts: 345
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overrestored wrote:
also...Arthur Zwebell... the old importer...still lives! I found him... I will visit him in the next year or so and I bet he can add a lot to our archive of knowledge.


I recently followed up on this... and the information I was given is wrong. Arthur Zwebell passed away in 1973 or so. I presume the Arthur Zwebell that is still alive... must be the son of the Arthur Zwebell who imported Rometsch cars. I will still track this guy down and try and interview him though... just to see what we can learn.

see this other thread:

http://forums.pre67vw.co...aspx?g=posts&t=17860


protect me from what I want
SplitPersonality Offline
#43 Posted : 27 January 2011 14:52:20(UTC)
SplitPersonality


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An old favorite of ours...

Recent research point towards a total production of VW-based Beeskow-designed Rometsch cars of about 100 cars in total from Feb1951-Oct1957. We are wokring on publisheable material on this topic and it will be put on the Registry website.

In relation to this, we have two questions/requests:

- We are desparately seeking buildnumbers off the tags on the 4-door Taxis, on the Goliaths, the Fiats and...any and all other products from Rometsch within the era.

...and:

- Does anybody have good links/sources to proven survival rates of other, comparable cars? For example 356 Speedsters, 300SLs, D&S, Gmund-Porsches....etc.
SplitPersonality Offline
#44 Posted : 27 January 2011 15:13:27(UTC)
SplitPersonality


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I will "do an Eric", and reply to myself:

This site:
http://993c4s.com/cars/p...356/1949-gmund-for-sale/

...shows a proven survival of 17 Gmund-Porsches over the 51 built. Leaving a survival rate of 17/51 = 33%.
(I know Mr Mertens will probably diagree on the number produced and the number of survivors - let us assume it evens out...)

Comparable to the Rometsch Beeskows in the sense they were in alu and handbuilt - and they were "always seen as a special car with special care". Yet....a Porsche has a stronger name, and of course much more race-history, with related wrecks.

I will sum up a couple of other we know:

Survival rates:

Gmund 356: 17/51 = 33%
Lawrence Rometsch: 30/85 = 35%
550 Spyders: ?/90 = ??
356 Speedster: ?
VW-based D&S: 18/43(??) = 42%

Do YOU have links to other "rare car registries" or survival rate info?
overrestored Offline
#45 Posted : 27 January 2011 17:18:28(UTC)
overrestored


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The Porsche 356 Convertible D registry (my "other car") shows that 549 cars still exist from a production of 1331 cars. D's were the successor for the Speedster... built only for 13 months... August 1958 through September 1959. (After this time the body style totally changed from the 50's era 356A style to the 1960 356B "Roadster" style with higher pointier bumpers, higher headlights... black steering wheel and knobs etc.)

The D in "356 Convertible D" stands for Drauz... the coachbuilder. Some people confuse this with the model name... 356A, 356B, 356C, 356SC etc. and think that a D is a later series car... which is incorrect.

With Convertible D's we see an approximately 41% survival rate. Similar to the rest of the cars in Oystein's list

see:

http://convertibledregistry.com/

Edited by user 27 January 2011 17:22:16(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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Bjoern Offline
#46 Posted : 11 July 2011 11:54:36(UTC)
Bjoern


Rank: pre67vw Junkie

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Location: Wolfsburg, Germany

I just had an interesting telephonecall from a mechanic who works for a famous Volkswagendealer of Berlin. I told me that he was a Fiat-guy and that he had restored a couple of vintage Fiats of the 1950s. After a couple of minutes he told me hat he also had a Rometsch. A Fiat Rometsch. It is the car which is acutal located at the famous Louwman-collection nearby Den Haag. I told him that I am really interested to know what kind of body-number that car has and he answered me that the car was produced in Januar 1956 and that all parts like the door panesl, hinges and so on were stamped with the number 117...
pbaptist Offline
#47 Posted : 11 July 2011 20:12:18(UTC)
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Bjoern wrote:
I just had an interesting telephonecall from a mechanic who works for a famous Volkswagendealer of Berlin. I told me that he was a Fiat-guy and that he had restored a couple of vintage Fiats of the 1950s. After a couple of minutes he told me hat he also had a Rometsch. A Fiat Rometsch. It is the car which is acutal located at the famous Louwman-collection nearby Den Haag. I told him that I am really interested to know what kind of body-number that car has and he answered me that the car was produced in Januar 1956 and that all parts like the door panesl, hinges and so on were stamped with the number 117...


Strange storyQuestion

I guess you are talking about this car.
I know it is in the Netherland, but didn't know that it was in the Louwman collection.

Edited by user 11 July 2011 20:14:34(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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SplitPersonality Offline
#48 Posted : 21 July 2011 13:24:52(UTC)
SplitPersonality


Rank: pre67vw Junkie

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Bjoern wrote:
I just had an interesting telephonecall from a mechanic who works for a famous Volkswagendealer of Berlin. I told me that he was a Fiat-guy and that he had restored a couple of vintage Fiats of the 1950s. After a couple of minutes he told me hat he also had a Rometsch. A Fiat Rometsch. It is the car which is acutal located at the famous Louwman-collection nearby Den Haag. I told him that I am really interested to know what kind of body-number that car has and he answered me that the car was produced in Januar 1956 and that all parts like the door panesl, hinges and so on were stamped with the number 117...


Wow - very interesting indeed Bjorn...I am tempted to call it a "revolution" in Rometsch-knowledge history...

Number "117" on a Rometsch-Fiat in January 1956, leads me to think the following:

- The known Rometsch-VWs from late55/early56 have numbers in the region 200-230.
- Number "117" (of all things) is the number also on a known, VW-Rometsch - produced in early 1951.

So.....I am tempted to think/conclude with the following theories:
- Rometsch started all their "brand unique" number series on the same number; 100 and numbered subsequently in order for the same brand..
- We know 100% the first VW-Rometsch had number 100 ... (late 1950) and reached about 275 (175 units) in mid-1957 before they changed the styling completely and used a new series starting on 500.
- The Holland-Fiat indicating that up until Jan 1956, they had built a total of 17 Fiat-based Rometsches.
- OR......could they have used a 4 or 5-digit number for the Fiats, but stamped on loose parts only the last 3 digits (as on Barndorrs and Porsches)?
pbaptist Offline
#49 Posted : 31 July 2011 21:43:52(UTC)
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The number 117 is confusing me:

The car is question is a Fiat 1100 TV coupe build on 30-06-1956. (That is what is registered on the licence)

What I have found during my research it is written that there were 50 Fiat 1400 Sportcabrio build between 1951-1953 and 50 Fiat 1100 TV Coupe build started from 1954. So it is unlikely that this car build was the 17th build Fiat, unless the build of the Fiat cars are also incorrect (what is logical if you look at the survivors. Zero Fiat 1400 and only 1 Fiat 1100)

Let asume that Rometsch didn't use separate numbers for each brand and that they only start a new numbering for the Rometsch Lawrence. Lets also asume that the productionnumbers on the fiat cars are also incorrect. And asume that they didn't number the Taxi convertions. (Ok, lots of assumpions Wink )

They started in 1950 with number 100.
Between 1951 - 1953, they build 25? Goliath GP 700, ?? Fiat 1400, some Hansa 1500 and some Rometsch beeskow.

Lets assume (Ok another assumption) Rometsch did only build around 70 cars in the years 1951-1953. We also know car Nr 172,174,178,179,180,182 were "new style" Beeskows and build in 1954. In 1954 they also prodcuced the last couple of Hansa's and started with the Fiat 1100. That can explain why we don't know any numbers between 182 and 200.

from 1955 till 1957 they produced the Beeskow, some of the Fiat 1100 and 4* Opel Kapitan Coupe. All these cars might have numbers between 200 and 270?

If the only know Fiat 1100, build in june 1956 had number 227 in stead of 117, my assumpions would have made sence. I live 30km from were the car is located. Unfortunately, I don't think I am allowed to unscrew anything from the car to doublecheck the number.

I am wandering what others think of my assumptions.

Patrick

Edited by user 31 July 2011 21:49:34(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

SplitPersonality Offline
#50 Posted : 02 August 2011 11:52:31(UTC)
SplitPersonality


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A lot of assumptions there Patrick.... I would suggest 2 assumptions:

- Let us assume that the number Bjorn read on the Fiat is the correct one.
- Let us assume that the "officially reported" build numbers from Rometsch are as inflated for Fiats (reported: 50+50, likely a dozen) as for VWs (reported: more than 500, likely less than 200)

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